Art Interview: I believe that any press is good press.

Bayo Iribhogbe in his New York studio

Bayo Iribhogbe: Yep, except for one guy who really swindled something out of me. I was just studying. I didn't know anything. That was about 10 years ago. A lady saw my work and we started talking just like we are now. You know, I kinda started to get interested in her. She said Bayo, I think I got somebody for you who will put you on television and so on in California. So we started talking and then I got connected with him and then after so many dialogs he said if I would pay him about $3,000 every 3 months he would get me put on T.V. and there are other things that would follow. I was getting excited. I didn't know. I didn't really have much experience with these con artists and I said, look I don't have $3,000.

He said well, what do you think what you can do. I said, I don't know if I can do anything let me think about and I went back home and I was still feeling excited about it and I thought ok, I can start with $2,000. I'll give him $2,000 and let's see how it goes. So I sent him a $2,000 check. That was the last I heard of him. Then I called the girl. I was too shy to talk to the girl really. I said Look... I said, no, I was too; my ego didn't allow me to say anything to her. I said forget it. I think this is really a scam. I would never have believed it. So, that's it. So I learned something from it.

That was the only problem I had - oh, there was another one but she's in jail now. A lady she, umm... I didn't lose anything from that because she sent me money through the electronic system and she said: Bayo, your work I can sell at any price. I have an 800 number; I have connections and so on. I said, okay, do whatever you wanna do as long as I don't have to pay you anything.

She said: Okay Bayo, and she sent me $2,000 and said: Just give me a few of your prints, 4 by 7, and I'll make copies of them and put them online and then eventually I will make bigger ones and I'll go from there and I'll let you know. When I start making my money you'll be getting money every month. I said: That's great.

Bayo Iribhogbe The Gathering, 2005 Oil on canvas 30" x 16"

So, when I sent her those prints, about one hundred of them, she likely destroyed them. They were sent through UPS, she destroyed them and then turned around and tried to sue UPS for 3 million dollars. See, that was her plan. And the credit card she used to send me money belonged to her grandmother.

It was a long story. In fact the FBI began watching my studio because she used to come to Chicago often, so they said they were watching it to get to her. First of all they sent security FBI people to come and check with me what connection I had to this lady and they found that I didn't have any. They asked me questions. I didn't even recognize her. She'd bought a little piece from me and then she called and wanted to do business with me. So that was it. Then they got her and they had about 19 points of indictment against her.

I went to a grand jury twice, you know, they wanted to hear my side of it. It was interesting. In fact I was going to do a show the day they asked me to come to the grand jury. I said I couldn't because I'm preparing for my show. They said: But if you don't we will put you into jail because this is federal business. I said; But what am I gonna do, this is my livelihood? They said don't worry we will ship everything there overnight. I said really? I said OK. My being at the court took only about maybe 10 to 15 minutes. That was it. And then they just got the shipper and they shipped everything straight to my show and when the show was over they shipped everything back to my studio. I said to these people, how do you work like this, so perfectly, you know. They said: Bayo that's the way we do things, we're the FBI. When that happened I learned more, too. As far as publicity is concerned I am always willing to let it go out because you never know who is going to read it.

Art Interview: What was it like when you were growing up? When were you born?

Bayo Iribhogbe: Well, I don't know, I try not to say too much about my birthday and stuff like that. I was born in Nigeria and I went to school there. Nigeria being kind of a laid-back country, we don't really have the kind of pressure they have here in this country or in America. So I decided to find a way. But actually I was so lucky because when the American embassy saw my artwork they said: Bayo, if you need anything let us know. That was how they said it. I said okay. So then I had admission papers to one of the universities in Chicago: U of C. and papers for NU. But I didn't have any money, I didn't have a ticket, but I had my passport. So I thought hmmm, these people told me if I needed any help I should let them know. So I went to the embassy where I knew a guy named James. I went to see James. He said; How are you? I said fine, I wanted to ask you if you could give me some assistance. I got admitted to a university in the U.S. He said: Oh, congratulations, are you going? I said: I would love to go, but I don't have the ticket. I have some money from my mom, but it's not enough. He said: Oh don't worry we'll give you the rest, and he gave me a check and I said: Thank you so much - so that's how I got to the States. It was very tough for me to assimilate into the system and I couldn't do it. I dropped out for about 6 months and then I went to the University of Chicago, which is one of the best universities in the country. They accepted me there. I applied for a Nigerian working scholarship but they turned me down because I did not want to work at home. They gave me a scholarship to go to school but when that ended I would just have to find my own way to go on. I didn't want to work. So I guess that was the reason why they didn't gave me the scholarship. So I went to the United States and things were tough, socially, but I went through it and I made it mostly, because I have a very strong heart, yeah, that's how I got there.

Art Interview: You were in New York by then?

Bayo Iribhogbe Relationship, 2004 Oil on canvas 10" x 20"

Bayo Iribhogbe: No, Chicago. I was working two jobs and I was really confused. I was teaching as well as working for a company. When the company saw my work somewhere, they said: Bayo, you are an artist what are you doing working for us? I said: Well, I don't think I could survive doing my art ´cause there're so many artists around. They said: Well, it looks like you can paint - why not paint something for us; just paint anything about teamwork. I said: Oh yeah, I can do that, but I'll do it when I feel like. They said: Okay, when you are ready let us know. When people give me that kind of freedom I can come up with something. So I just thought to myself: Hmm, yes! The Cubs game; when they win they come to the center and they give the high-five. So I did it in an abstract form, very quickly. It didn't take me much more than an hour. When I showed them a slide of it - they said: We like it, we like it - can we see the original? So I brought them the original. Then they asked: How much is it? I said, I have no idea, man, how about $1,500? They said: No problem, and this guy gave me a check. I thought to myself, man this is my biggest painting. Up to then the most I had gotten for a painting was around $200.

I started painting gingerly; I would do about one painting a year. It took me about 3 years to finally make up my mind and then I told the company that I was working for that I was leaving. They said: What, leaving, why? I said: I want to try my art. They said: That's impossible, you see all of these artists; they don't do well. They just leave their art in the gallery. When you work for us you can take care of your family. We give you vacation so you can go home to Nigeria. Why would you want to throw that away? I said: Yes, I know that, but I think I've got to do this now. They tried to convince me to stay but something was telling me to go. Then they said: OK, we will give you a month off. Go back to Nigeria, take it easy and then come back and you will get your job back. I said that's nice. Then I went back to my apartment. I thought: one month - that's beautiful, that's great. But something else was telling me Bayo go. I kept listening to my inner self and in my mind I said Bayo do what you have to do, this is it. So I went back to the company and I told them no, I'm leaving.

So I left. I was still teaching but there was not much money there. I thought: Man, I'm not getting off as I normally would, how am I gonna do this? Where am I gonna start? So the first thing I did was to quit my apartment. I told my boy to stay with his mother. Then I rented a small basement apartment and I stayed there. My old friends who came around, they said: Bayo, what are you doing here? I said: I'm gonna be painting. They said: That's great, now let's go to your room, let's go and sit down. I said: This is where I'm gonna sit now. They say: YEAH, on the floor? I say: Yeah, is something wrong or what? Every weekend we would go and play soccer together, we would take turns entertaining each other. One week we would go to my place for a beer and then the next we would go to the other guy's place and so on. They were talking amongst themselves and they said there must be something wrong. I said: There is nothing wrong; we can have fun here too. They didn't believe me, so they just turned their backs against me and left. I didn't see them again for quite a while. But gradually they started noticing things about my work in different places. Then they started to come around again. They said: Bayo, we're sorry, how are you doing? I said: Don't worry about me, I'm doing okay, and I just let them go. I didn't mess with them. Instead I made new friends, completely new friends. So I started like that. I would be driving to the malls and to street shows selling my work. I started with prints but I stopped with the prints when the people wanted my original paintings. For a whole year I did shows every week, from mall-shows to street-shows to home-shows, making paintings. I was like a factory, man. I learned a lot from that, then I started deleting the shows I didn't want.

Art Interview: Was your art similar to what you're doing now?

Bayo Iribhogbe Mandela II, 1993 Oil on canvas 23" x 29"

Bayo Iribhogbe: No, a little bit similar but less attractive, less detail and the content was not as meaningful. I gradually began doing bigger shows. I opened up my own gallery in Chicago, which was unheard of for an artist. I think I was probably the only one at the time from what I understand. I was there for 3 years and it worked out perfectly fine, so I said, I gotta move on now. I've got to go to New York. People told me no Bayo, New York is too much. New York is too expensive. But when people tell me things like that, I do it. That's me. I'm very stubborn.

So I went to New York and it was tough. I went to another basement again, which was very expensive; three times the price of the rent in Chicago. But I was at the center of SoHo, and if anybody asked where Bayo was they could easily find me. The people started to come by and they felt comfortable. They said: Bayo, this is nice. I said; I don't like it, but they said: Don't worry, we like your work anyway. So I had been there for 3 years when the landlord noticed some kind of traffic. He said: Bayo, I've got to raise your rent this is a commercial building. He told me he wanted $6,000 a month instead of $1,500. That really scared me. I tried to plead with him. I went to my lawyer but he told me: Bayo it is a commercial space. If it were a normal housing area we maybe could do something, but he can ask for any amount he wants. Luckily I found my current studio in Brooklyn, it's the best studio I've ever had. I get a lot of foot-traffic. It is a big space, tall windows, high ceilings, plenty of room, and quiet - which I need, plenty of quiet, and unlike in the heart of New York every minute there is nice.

The entire time that I have been in New York I have been making connections to the middle-class people. They learn about me through their friends. They go to my website. They tell their friends about this guy who paints colors and their friends come looking for me, so that's how I've been working. Now I'm very selective of where I go and what shows I do and in addition to that I want to try and move beyond New York. I've been traveling to other countries for a while and showing my work. My next step will be to open my own gallery in New York and hire somebody to run it so I can just paint. Eventually I won't be traveling around anymore, I'm not getting younger. So, that's my plan.

Art Interview: This year you have done quiet a bit of traveling back and forth from Europe to the USA. How do you manage to transport all your paintings?

Bayo Iribhogbe The Gathering, 2005 Oil on canvas 30" x 16"

Bayo Iribhogbe: I think that has to do with experience, because artists often ask me that. I've learned to package my work very well. First, I started with a truck. I put everything into the truck, and then from there I shifted to getting a driver to help me. Then after that I started making portable display stuff that I put in my van. Then later I sold everything. I said no more drivers. I have two pieces of luggage 32x20, so I sized my boards to that size to fit into the luggage and then the bigger pieces I would just wrap up and put them in and when I get to a show I just display them without stretching them. My first year of traveling, two years ago, I was stretching my paintings on heavy plywood and then framing them. They were too heavy. I said no, there has to be another way. So now I'm using foam-boards. No more framing. I stretch my canvas around the foam-board and staple them and square them up very nicely so that when you put them up on the wall you don't need any frames. I said wow, you can even put about 10 of them on your palm, they are so light, that's great - this is what I want. So now I can ship about 40 pieces without much weight to worry about. The foam board is very cheap; it's about $10 for an 8-foot by 4-foot piece. I get up to 6 pieces out of that, which is very, very cheap and then I buy whole canvas, a whole roll, which lasts me sometimes up to 6 months. I paint very prolifically. I paint all the time. You should see my walls. They are covered all around with paintings. Now that I have this space I'm very happy. First time my landlord saw me he thought I was just kidding. He said: Bayo, you're getting one of the biggest places, how are you gonna pay for it? Well, I said, do you want the money?! Okay, don't worry; I'll give you the money. Then one day, one evening he said: Can I see your artwork? I say: Yes, of course. So he walked in with his wife, I think he was trying to check on me, he walked into the studio. He got so carried away just by the entrance to my studio. He said: Wow, what is this, all of these beautiful colors. Before he left, he bought 3 pieces, light pieces and said: Bayo, you don't have to pay the rent for the next 4 months. We love your work; we didn't know you could paint like this. We're gonna tell our friends - they are Jewish people with a lot of money. We're gonna tell all of them, we're gonna put them in our home, they're gonna see them. I say - Wow; that's it! (Laughs).

Packaging is very essential if you wanna travel. It's the way I package that is so great. I can carry so many in the plane. It's too expensive to ship paintings, and then you have to deal with the customs.

Art Interview: So you package everything up and then take it on the plane?

Bayo Iribhogbe: Yes I just take them on the plane with me. When they ask me what I do I say I am an artist. I went to Zurich last time.

Art Interview: Have you had any problems traveling?

Bayo Iribhogbe: As long as I have my passport I have no problems. Have your passport, that's it. Declare yourself, what do you do, that are you going for business.

Art Interview: How have you made your contacts to these exhibition places in other countries?

This oral history transcript is the result of a tape-recorded interview with Bayo Iribhogbe on April 25 2005 interview took place in Berlin, Germany, and was conducted by Brendan Davis for Art Interview Online Magazine.